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DeusEx 2: Invisible war Thread.

Postby HusK » Wed Nov 26, 2003 2:05 am

Origional topic: DeusEx demo...petition...

So....any of you guys checked the new DX:IW demo out?

In my oppinion it lacked alot of what made DX1 cool, the graphix are okay ( not stunning ) but I don't care about that, the story will be fine I'm sure so no trouble there,

the AI is troubling....shooting someone once who then says 'cary on' is far from how I would like to see it, and when an alarm is given because a turret has shot a soldier they shouldn't know it was me and all start hunting for me at the slightest sound I make.

The HUD is terrible, a food piece takes the same amount as a gun, which takes the same amount as a flamethrower...and what the hell is it with the lack of inventory anyway?

They removed the skills...one of the main reasons I like the game so much, offcourse some had to be removed as there where just to many hardly usefull ones.

They removed the passwords / logins for security systems, aaaaaaaaah this is probably the one thing I liked most about the game, searching for logins, guesing them, hacking them.

They removed all small intresting bits like a credit terminal where you can redraw cash like its the real thing (now its click and 5 secs later its hacked and you auto got the credits)

Well...need I go on? Its the little things that made it so cool. But also some of the major things are gimped like hell, the augmentation system has been made far to small, no more real choices about what augment to use, what to upgrade, etc etc.

Well therefore the online gaming community has started a petition to delay this game till ISA fixes and polishes it, adds more content like stuff about, changes things around to work proper, optimizes to code to work properly with high end cards (a radion 9800 Pro has more bugs with it than my GF3 TI200 lolz)

Play the demo a few times and sign the petition with your thoughts :)

http://www.petitiononline.com/DXIWDemo/
Last edited by HusK on Sat Dec 27, 2003 12:20 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Postby HusK » Wed Nov 26, 2003 3:00 am

ok been looking into things all night now, it seems there is hope yet.
There are different screenshots around which show different huds, and there are different storys on how the IA etc works compared to the demo.

Its looks as if xbox(To hell with the xbox) stuff has gotten mixed up with pc stuff...however warren did say the two will be almost identical so I gues we have to hope here he doesn't live up to that.

Still after reviewing all info I could find I think there is still hope this game will get my money some day...gonna download it first and check it out, if its not good I'll buy it from a old-game shelve in some months for 20$ :p
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Postby HusK » Wed Nov 26, 2003 9:18 pm

Hey where did all those DeusEx fans I saw earlier run off to?
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Postby Jest » Wed Nov 26, 2003 9:52 pm

Unfortunately I can't even get past the demo installation. :evil:
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Postby ReD HaZe » Thu Nov 27, 2003 12:49 pm

Husk dude i was a big fan of DX1, but tbh iv'e taken a looksy at alot of previews and screenies of this little puppy, not played the demo yet as I have a few isp issues so DLing is slow. I must say im dissapointed that its becoming to look like a port from a console game.

From what you have said above it looks like alot has changed =(. I'll get the demo of course and try for myself, but if the atmosphere that made DX1 so great and replayable is missing then im not gunna bother with it.

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Postby HTEC9900 » Thu Nov 27, 2003 6:18 pm

After seeing that petition site, I am now afraid to lay a finger on the demo. Yes, I was DX1's bitch for the longest time (and still am) but if DX2 is going to be simplified and have the feel of a (erm..simple) console game, then I'm going to be shitting bricks for the next few weeks. Well, I'll find some time to download the demo and give it a go.
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Postby HusK » Thu Nov 27, 2003 11:51 pm

guys, I'm not saying the game aint worth the money (not anymore anyway)

I took my time to play it a little more and get a better grip on what bugged me and what I could live with.

Basicly its like this: The demo is build in a very short time and doesn't realy show any of the deusex universe (as confirmed by Ion Storm Austin on there forums)
Which means you won't find any conspiracy's or ingame stuff in the demo, its two small maps with a rather short and pathetic story.

The demo is like the neocron demo, it shows absolutely nothing of what the game is about but it lets you familiarize with the game hud and the way it works in general.

The problem with the demo is for instance that you can't save settings, because some moron at ISA made the personal files readonly ( change that in your documents folder and your deusex demo folder )
And even then it doesn't work completely correct.
Another thing is that the graphix are scaled down in the game, bumpmaping, detailed textures etc etc are gone.
Another problem with the demo is that its actualy a port from the xbox vesion, you can see that easily if you browse trough the ini files, you'll find xbox settings all over the place.

So what you are seeing is the xbox version of deusex withoud any conspiracy's, story's or anything else that makes sence.

Facts that we do know for the pc version are:
  • Universal ammo: Altho I hate this because when you empty your flamethrower it means your out of ammo completely, which makes you loose your backup guns( except for the bullets already loaded in them )
    It is something I could live with tho, no problem for me there.
  • Removed skills: You no longer have to add skillpoints to skills, it means you are from start an experienced sniper, shotgunner, explosive specialist, etc etc.
    Me not like this, but again I could live with this because there is still the augmentation system, note that the skill for hacking is moved to augmentations, as far as I can tell none of the other skills are moved there tho...but then again nobody is sure what parts of the demo are real footage for the real game, and there is realy no other information out on that subject that could tell me more.
  • The augmentation system is reduced to 6 slots, for 6 bodyparts, every body part has a choice of 3 augmentations, every augmentation can be upgraded except for the light augmentation. As it looks now you can switch augmentations if you have multiple on a certain body spot, but you can have only one of the three active.
    If that is the case then I'm particulary happy with this choice, even if I'm not correct and it involves removing the old implant, and even if you can choose only one implant for the rest of the game I think its still good, if its like the last possiblity ( it does look like its the first tho ) then its simply defining the play style you choose. So this looks good for me.
  • The inventory is reduced to a complete total of 10 (or 11?) slots, on item no matter the size takes one slot.
    This is rather strange, the size of the inventory is rather small, you can carry a big lot of guns offcourse, but I also like to carry lams, medkits, energy packs, candy(?), and more of that shit :p
    Well this is definatly not good for the overal feel, but its not something that makes the game unworthy to buy and play.
  • The notes etc. are removed.
    2bad, it was nice to browse back conversations once in a while, altho I rarely did that anyway (I think about 5 times in the total of 9 times I finished the game from start to end)
  • Security camera's no longer need passwords.
    This realy sucks, altho eventualy I hacked em anyway I did like the idea of it existing, and the idea that you where actualy on a pc screen ( now its in your existing hud )
    It spoils alot of fun, and I mean alot. But then again...Is it reason enough to not play the game? Maybe they did add it with the PC version, as the only footage I have of it is the demo, which was an xbox build "ported" to the pc, and most people know the xbox usualy don't have a keyboard, which makes it hard to type passwords :p


I think thats about it, the rest is still like it was before, conversations, choices, plots, minimisions, primary missions, secondary missions, guns, books to read, only thing I'm not sure about is email accounts to hack, but I'm pretty sure they are still there as that was in the past a rather important part of the story.

Oh and the hud...you get used to it, eventualy it didn't bug me much anymore. Only that does bug me a little is the way you select things in your inventory...you move stuff around rather easily when you don't want to :p, but I'm sure they fixed that in the full.

My conclusion is that the game seems JUST about worth my money and time, so it can realy only get better for me, I'm especialy glad to know that the demo realy is nothing like the game and that its also an xbox demo ported to pc ;)

Oh and one last note: People are not sure this demo was build from beta stuff or from finished stuff because there are two screenshots types out with different looks, changed huds etc. Nobody is realy sure which one is the accurate, probably also a mixup with xbox and pc screenshots on the sites....
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Postby HTEC9900 » Fri Nov 28, 2003 4:01 pm

[TgR]HusK wrote:...Another problem with the demo is that its actualy a port from the xbox vesion, you can see that easily if you browse trough the ini files, you'll find xbox settings all over the place...


Noooooo! We have been tainted! -lol-
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Postby HusK » Fri Nov 28, 2003 4:20 pm

what does the word 'tainted' mean?
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Postby ReD HaZe » Fri Nov 28, 2003 4:53 pm

Tainted = Messed with/changed/made unpure ...

Dling the demo as i type, let ya know what i think a little later :D
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Postby HusK » Fri Nov 28, 2003 7:34 pm

make sure to make all files writeable ( read: not 'read-only' ) Including the ones it writes in your 'my documents' folder

and use the following tool to get the demo's settings to a more acceptable level(realy use this): http://www.deusexzone.info/downloads.php?file_id=451

And turn off 'bloom' in the options, especialy when you got an ATI card, bloom makes the games graphics look a little bit softer, or rather... terrible :p so turn it off for the sake of mankind ( no comment ;) )
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Postby HusK » Sat Dec 27, 2003 12:08 am

Well I promised a few weeks ago to write a small review on the game, so here it comes :x

as a kickoff: This gome r0ckz0rz y0urS SP rPg WOrlDz :shock: o_O :x

Ok lets start with the earlier mentioned con's:
  • Universal ammo, as much as it sounds weird and stupid and terrible for gameplay, you will find its actualy not such a bad decision, and they didn't forget to write a story around the thing, how it works etc. Fits completely into the new game and is neither a Con or a Pro.
    Since there is much ammo to be found and every guard drops ammo you won't realy get in trouble when your not paying attention to the ammount of ammo you got, thus: Grade 7
  • Removed skills, definatly a con, but not as bad as I expected it to be, the augmentation system makes up a little for the loss, but still I like to put skills in some places, however you do become more focused on augmentations because of this, which is probably what Warren wanted. It also fits better in the story and therefore I will give it a grade 5 not to bad
  • Augmentation system. this is both con and pro, and no I wouldn't call it neutral either ;). the system itself is great, lesser slots is cooler because it makes it harder to choose what you want, your chooses also define your gameplay, if your going killing or not killing, stealth or fps style, as a bot dominator or as a one man army, whatever you want to do is going to make your selection of augmentations, also augmentations can make up for inventory losses, for example more muscles creats extra inventory slots, or choosing a remote controlled drone with emp attack makes sure you won't have to carry any emp granades, if you choose bot domination you won't have to use scrambler granades, if you choose health regenaration you don't need medkits, and the list goes on :x
    The con of the system is that augmentation canisters are now almost universal, you have legal and illigle augmentation canisters which can be used to install (or re-install if you wish to change augmentations for a certain bodypart, I was right on that part :x) or upgrade your augmentation, there is only a difference between legal augmentations and the more cool illigle ones. Also this wouldn't have been so bad if it was for the fact that there are far to many canisters to be gotten, most if not all of your augmentations will be at max level when your just half way trough the game. This realy isn't cool because the kick of finding them becomes lower and lower. grade 6
  • the notes, images, and goals remain as they where, with the only exception that you cannot edit them or add more notes, removes a little of the fun but still its a pro. grade 7
  • Security camera's, turrets and computer terminals indeed no longer need a password, still they can be hacked and you can also still find notes around that give you access right away, but it works like a key instead of a username plus password, which sucks if you ask me. Probably done for the xbox as I said before. Since it does exist but the fun is lower I'll give it a low grade 6
  • No more emails, aaaaaaaaah sucks bigtime :cry: There are books with journals and notes around to make a little bit up for it, but it doesn't come close to the old fun. grade 4
  • Graphics, they are okayish, the dynamic shadow/lightning system, which is simular what Doom III uses, is rather cool, it just barely makes up for the lack of performance on my system, and you can't disabled it yet, I'm sorry to say, even with patch v1.1.
    My geforce 3 Ti200 overclocked to the GF3 Ti500 settings is just enough to play the game at playable framerates (using a Atlon XP 2000 cpu with 512MB of DDR-SDRAM 266 (PC2100) on a soltek SL75-DRV2 mainboard running on windows XP Pro, withoud servicepack 1).
    The rest of the graphics are below unreal 2 graphics, and are comparable with other games of this time, especialy the character detail is lower than I would like to see, but perhaps that is also because of my old videocard which doesn't have the great options of DirectX 9, which the game uses if I recall correctly.



Reading above you might think this game completely destroy your hopes on the game, but trust me the story makes up for it 250% :shock: 8)

Once again the first level is to crappy for words, this was one of the major problems why the origional deusex didn't become as popular as it could have been, the fans of the genre and the diehards offcourse now think otherwise, but I know the sales rate of the game was rather low and I also know most people around me hated that first level in the origional, and stop playing from there, not being inside the story enough to be addicted and scared off because of the lack of direction and skills which made fighting in the first level terrible compared to other fps.
I won't disclose to much details but as usual when you get into the game a little further the first level starts to make sence.
One thing they did good in this game, is the firepower skills (btw headshots are possible again with patch v1.1) which makes this game also apealing to the hardcore killing machines, that are in love with games like unreal and halo.

Overall game experience:
After I got out of the complex you start in, I slowly got back to the old DeusEx feeling, doing every little mission around, exploring the parts of the city you have access to, gaining access to appartments, stealing shit, reading shit, etc etc etc etc etc :p

Another fun part is once again the options of choosing your gameplay, not so much by choosing certain answers in conversations, but more based on your actions, what missions you do and what missions you decide not to do because you don't agree with it. You can also if you want choose to be neutral and do missions for both the two major factions, being neutral makes the game easier but probably less fun, anyway the replayability is very high so do what you want when you want, start roleplaying :) be badass or be a friend of the people, and trust me when you start to think you know whois good and whois bad, you might just be in for a surprise.
Your choice in conversations still trigger events, some could be big some could be small, but so far it was more the decisions in gameplay I made that choose the direction of the story, the story is still lineair as it was in the origional, but there are many many ways to do things and to reach certain parts of the story. I can continue far longer on this part of the gameplay, but lets just say this part of the game desirves a grade 10+ :D

As I said, alot of suprises in this game, for example at some point you might think your nearing the end of the game... only to find out you where fooled. That particular thing is rather cool, and again something you also had at some points in the origional game.
Other suprises include... *cough* you'll just have to play the game :shock: 8)


Now for the small parts to finish off:
Weapons are not that origional, but there enough of em, there cool enough to not care about them, you will probably resort to using your tranq. darts gun, SMG gun, or shotgun, but other than that there is offcourse a sniper, a handgun, a poison knife, a normal knife, a nanite enhanced blade, a stunprod, a police stick thingy, an experimental weapon, weapons that I haven't found yet, and offcourse the usual explosive grenades, emp grenades, smoke grenades, flash grenades, placeable detonator grenades, placeable EMP grenades, and more where that came from :o
conversations are cool, black market dudes around, small missions around, bars and coffee shops around, and more of the things you expect from deusex.
As with the first deusex, there aren't realy much sexy pixelled girls...darn :p

I can go on and on to bore you more but I'll just stop with giving it a final grade.

Grade: 8

High, mostly because its succesfull at making this feel like a DeusEx game, which in the end the only thing we all care about :p


To compare my grade giving: for example I would grade Neocron a 8, I would grade morrowind an 8, I would grade unreal 2 an 8, I would grade Gothic (1&2)an 8. ifact the only game ever I grade higher than an 8 is the origional DeusEx, which I give a 9 :x
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